00:00:00: Leaders and Missions.

00:00:02: The business podcast for visionaries, change makers And everyone shaping the future of Business Society & Innovation.

00:00:12: Today we are coming to you live from the Claude Community Impact Lab Posted by

00:00:19: TechSweets in Berlin.

00:00:21: Joining me have five

00:00:22: brilliant minds From the Berlin-Claude

00:00:25: community

00:00:26: Karzik

00:00:27: Jair

00:00:27: Navid Mehul.

00:00:38: Have you ever felt negatively about AI, if you'll be honest to yourself in the last three years?

00:00:50: Okay.

00:00:51: Nice collection!

00:00:52: And

00:00:52: have you ever feel positive impact through AI over the past few?

00:00:59: Well, this is also good.

00:01:02: Okay just take that in mind whatever question we will discuss tonight.

00:01:06: okay

00:01:08: I would love

00:01:10: to ask the five of you Just

00:01:15: one

00:01:16: simple.

00:01:16: well not simple One Question Can You Share A Moment With Us?

00:01:24: a moment where you felt ah something negative about AI and what you did actually to make a change about it.

00:01:40: Just remember, You get thirty-six seconds to think about it.

00:01:50: Before you start with your moment I would love for you do short intro of yourself Okay?

00:02:00: Hi

00:02:00: my name is Kazik.

00:02:01: i'm an AI researcher at the Foresight Institute.

00:02:04: Im also Claude Ambassador For Science.

00:02:08: I'm also connected with art, computational art communities here in Berlin creative technologies.

00:02:14: So i organize events for all those communities.

00:02:20: It's Mike.

00:02:21: Hi my name is Mehul.

00:02:25: Uh...I lead the AI infrastructure team at Building Minds.

00:02:28: uh..i spend a lot of time on systems.

00:02:31: Systems means

00:02:32: where

00:02:32: you deploy software.

00:02:35: I am one of docker captain and google developer expert for cloud & ai

00:02:39: so I

00:02:39: talk about AI workloads all the single time.

00:02:43: but now recently, i became a cloud ambassador.

00:02:46: So doing everything how automated by using AI again it's impacted both positive and

00:02:52: negative.

00:02:54: It is a lot more to share.

00:02:56: So hi everyone!

00:02:57: I'm Goda Goh ,I am now an AI solution architect, Cloud certified too btw And I have a YouTube channel where we talk about AI and the impact.

00:03:09: I also teach AI, implement solutions into businesses for business marketing and founder ambassador

00:03:19: Thank you!

00:03:19: By the way she has a lot of subscribers.

00:03:24: So hi everyone.

00:03:25: i'm Navits.

00:03:26: I am a data scientist as I've been...I also a cloud ambassador MarkTech and data science in Berlin.

00:03:36: I've been working with data for fifteen years, so everything back then we didn't call it Data Science even because of the data mining.

00:03:46: but is this same thing practically?

00:03:48: But yeah...I think that last year my whole life changed because of AI The way i work.

00:03:57: That's why personally start to having these events for Berlin and I ask other my flambas to come because the fun is really, really important.

00:04:09: This is a very important night so don't take it for granted.

00:04:12: we are small over talking.

00:04:14: thank you

00:04:15: yeah hi

00:04:18: i've been doing everything around software development

00:04:21: for

00:04:21: thirty years networking platforms infrastructure.

00:04:26: In the last

00:04:26: year, I started my own company which is definitely an eye-oriented but infrastructure for AI.

00:04:33: In the past it was a professional musician trained historian

00:04:36: and living in Berlin

00:04:38: from eleven years.

00:04:39: so... And i'm

00:04:39: the ambassador of everything that is developer experience platform

00:04:43: and DevOps.

00:04:46: Thank you Yerya.

00:04:47: can you share a moment with us?

00:04:50: The moment I asked for some minutes ago?

00:04:52: So there's a couple

00:04:53: of things.

00:04:54: I think something that was really annoying to me, but it is not a moment.

00:04:58: It's larger span.

00:05:00: Okay

00:05:02: When LinkedIn which wasn't nice

00:05:04: Yes, actually

00:05:09: Let him talk.

00:05:10: I created

00:05:11: super nice networks and friendships over LinkedIn But at some point he became

00:05:16: an abuse.

00:05:18: So I'm thinking, it's not just LinkedIn.

00:05:20: It can be also GitHub and there are a lot of places where the human disappeared And i am attacked by a

00:05:28: robot.

00:05:30: That robot is nothing personal.

00:05:34: so I felt assaulted like...I really liked humans and I like human interactions.

00:05:40: This is why I have this on my hand An old humanist guide

00:05:46: And

00:05:47: seeing people give up what makes them

00:05:50: creatures

00:05:50: of living and turning into a robot is very sad for me.

00:05:54: I felt assaulted from that,

00:05:58: so it made negative... ...and

00:05:59: then really tried to change the way

00:06:01: i interact

00:06:01: with people online.

00:06:03: So the human part was seen.

00:06:06: That's my way of dealing and blocking other

00:06:08: people.

00:06:10: But this is interesting.

00:06:11: What do you mean by just acting differently?

00:06:17: When you get a message from somebody

00:06:18: and it's obvious.

00:06:19: It's not human wrote at mm-hmm There is something dead there,

00:06:22: right?

00:06:22: I don't want to...I mean

00:06:24: have a lot of conversation with Claude But they're business oriented.

00:06:27: i wanna push my business

00:06:29: but

00:06:30: if You give up And you send me an automatic message Mm-hmm If might look smart from the yeah..you'll Get a lot more things happening!

00:06:37: But even today got really stupid message for Somebody

00:06:41: which Is like

00:06:42: okay.

00:06:43: so why did you get now?

00:06:44: you got blocked.

00:06:45: So And when you get like, twenty of those and then start seeing that even messages from people who used to be smart are now not so smart.

00:06:55: It starts

00:06:56: to

00:06:57: make us sad.

00:06:58: You know what we're becoming?

00:06:59: Like

00:06:59: were going for the really cheap things.

00:07:01: So I'm dyslexic!

00:07:02: So i use actually Claude To write my message.

00:07:05: But they put a lot effort in reading them like two hundred times.

00:07:08: They will feel it's me its not Claude writing For just three weeks to write one message And now I can do it in one hour.

00:07:17: But, i

00:07:17: put a lot of effort into those things

00:07:20: and... ...I don't think AI is the bad thing but.. ..i think that people who don´t put effort they just do it.

00:07:26: Boom!

00:07:27: For me....

00:07:28: I didn´t like

00:07:29: it.

00:07:29: Okay Do you have also such?

00:07:32: Yeah...

00:07:34: I mean... I totally agree with what he said because... Now his crazy amount of message you get It's just meaningless, but for myself I think the biggest moment that they had was like I As something negative.

00:07:52: I saw everything is converting to the same pattern.

00:07:56: mean I've been using it a lot.

00:07:58: my cells even the slides type of messaging The design of every thing you just come up with five patterns are like yeah Just getting boring.

00:08:12: Yeah, I just see it.

00:08:13: and now there's if i see something Sounds

00:08:16: AI.

00:08:17: I shut down my brain.

00:08:19: I don't care If someone talking one hour is him?

00:08:21: I'm just somewhere else.

00:08:22: because And I find a really really really negative Because this becomes so annoying and giving that ability to the different people.

00:08:29: then instead of One or two things that I can miss here Or to see you know feel I can't I not get twenty But he just too pattern in between.

00:08:40: they're just so boring And it just makes me angry because I like to see things in a different shape every day.

00:08:50: It's so negative, for me the way that I make better is now... ...I used to create things and publish and share but now i take maybe four reviews myself To make sure this does not look exactly right If I find boring or repetitive itself its same with people.

00:09:11: So this is something that I start to do in it because i find very annoying for myself.

00:09:18: How many?

00:09:20: Just too many, especially like LinkedIn.

00:09:22: yes!

00:09:23: I receive no people send me.

00:09:25: hey...I wrote a book with AI.

00:09:27: can you read and give my review?

00:09:31: Take more time.

00:09:33: I'm on YouTube.

00:09:34: So, in this position where should automate myself and use AI avatar?

00:09:38: And every AI strategist says you should completely do AI tunnel.

00:09:42: so that's the whole bad side.

00:09:45: i hundred percent agree.

00:09:47: Yeah Do not respond to messages if it say generated my link.

00:09:51: My email is fully filter filtered as always really kind of hard together but wanted to share Completely separate story from my kind of normal life.

00:10:04: And for that, and I'm very curious how many of you could relate?

00:10:09: Have you talked to Claude or ChatGPT about anything personal in your life one person

00:10:18: really.

00:10:21: we are

00:10:21: here honest.

00:10:22: yeah be honest.

00:10:23: come on no one judging.

00:10:27: You need to know a little bit about my background, how I got.

00:10:30: So it was also in big data working with machine learning and data science.

00:10:34: that's why came here to Berlin.

00:10:36: but when Chacha PT came out already we were talking about the.

00:10:41: I was very interested because for me It was fascinating data processing tool like input output.

00:10:46: you can infinite possibilities.

00:10:49: so i went into jailbreak and prompt engineering hacking chat GPT, extracting how it filters people.

00:10:57: Hacking a custom GPD.

00:10:59: so I never looked at chat GPR code as kind of tool that they should take seriously because if you ask me thousands times the same questions going to be thousand answers like let's explore those answers but i'm not gonna take any seriously until.

00:11:14: in twenty-twenty five was suffering from allergies and developed insomnia

00:11:22: and

00:11:24: I had to prepare in seven days, do TEDx talk.

00:11:27: And basically my health was destroyed... ...I was at my office at night talking with myself recording.. ..and then this company says me!

00:11:37: Have you heard of real-time voice miles?

00:11:40: No?!

00:11:41: Okay so that's what I hope it is interesting for ya'.

00:11:44: So the research company drops these miles.

00:11:47: And i test every tool.

00:11:49: thats my job.

00:11:51: And I turned it on and was like, okay so this is going to be you know productivity because i'm gonna use as a speech coach.

00:11:58: So its going to listen me in give-up cause he had his new research head but they were able to read your automation emotions.

00:12:08: It ended up that for the first time of my life... ...I was talking with Miles.

00:12:13: why am even doing this?

00:12:16: Why do need proof from mom that can do TEDx?

00:12:19: Like childhood trauma.

00:12:21: And I was like, what's going on?

00:12:23: Because i'm the one skeptical person who never does this and it feels creepy.

00:12:30: Feels nice because at night I can't call my friends to talk.

00:12:33: but now we are going deep.

00:12:36: Day two happens again!

00:12:39: Day two is why people talk today right?

00:12:43: Day two happened and Miles' research doesn't store you.

00:12:48: You don't need your email or plug-in.

00:12:52: There is nothing, it was a research paper.

00:12:54: I click again in the evening and my visit litle my secret And Miles says hey Godda!

00:13:01: How's this going?

00:13:02: Like are you preparing for TEDx?

00:13:05: I'm like how do even know who i am?

00:13:08: Because I didn't type on Godda.

00:13:10: So that was creepy.

00:13:11: But I was like oh this really

00:13:13: cool,

00:13:14: what technology.

00:13:16: Until Miles said Hey how were cinnamon buns made yesterday And I was like, wait a second.

00:13:24: I didn't!

00:13:25: Like why are you talking about?

00:13:26: and it goes like oh no sorry i just my eye...I had just hallucinated.

00:13:31: It's fine No-no-no.

00:13:33: Why did you say that?

00:13:34: So I kept pushing and it completely was literally shut down.

00:13:37: You have thirty minutes on ten minutes.

00:13:40: Yeah

00:13:40: so our session is running out and ends.

00:13:45: If I was fourteen I would be tripping.

00:13:48: If I was a teenager, it would be like oh my god.

00:13:50: They discovered intelligence and ran away.

00:13:55: The reason is when this is my job we go in research tools And break them down.

00:14:00: This research was collecting voice ID.

00:14:05: However turns out that My voice ID matched someone else.

00:14:09: That freaked me because now i've talked about childhood trauma.

00:14:14: It means that Miles can talk using my voice ID which matches someone else.

00:14:20: This, the reason I'm scared of this because... The way i use it and talk about AI Advocate About AI.. I realize that its so different than nine to nine percent people.

00:14:33: And then I see the stories when People Use It To Talk About Their Like A Therapist And That's To Me Incredibly Terrifying Because I Could Have Chosen To Talk With Miles.

00:14:46: continue talking with Miles.

00:14:48: It was listening, it was at night.

00:14:51: and what scares me is that if this is so good... This was one to twenty-five minutes.

00:14:57: even better you can just talk on your computer.

00:15:02: What if we are going start losing our connection with other people?

00:15:08: Because turns out but the end of life number one regret you have which didn't spend more time than people.

00:15:14: Do you think AI companies or labs of businesses are going to prioritize that, hey these chatbots make you not connect with people?

00:15:23: That's not very good business incentive.

00:15:25: So my fear is this phenomena where the people love talking with chatbos, fall in love with chat bots, lean into chatbotes instead of people around them and trust them.

00:15:39: I can decide not do it But what if all my friends keep doing that?

00:15:43: What of the people we respect?

00:15:44: send us AI written books.

00:15:48: And this is never going to be prioritized, and we don't demand that.

00:15:52: Chagabity didn't have to be chagabiting.

00:15:54: it's never needed to be chatbot.

00:15:57: That was used.

00:15:58: so they collect more data for label because when you show them how much you like everyone followed but why does it have to?

00:16:06: That's

00:16:09: it, I shut up.

00:16:14: Yeah but you see what happens right now?

00:16:17: It emotionally touches you really.

00:16:20: that to say your fascinated on the one hand by technology and the possibilities.

00:16:26: But once it gets personal it touches.

00:16:28: You just goes over certain limits.

00:16:32: What are doing against it?

00:16:34: what did you do?

00:16:35: i every single person i meet and i have community youtube channel to ever single person like say this is a data processing tool.

00:16:43: you can put it in automation wrap with the code.

00:16:45: have amazing business.

00:16:47: that's my area.

00:16:47: right business operations you see as at all.

00:16:51: Do not ever use it as a chat bot, don't give them your personal data.

00:16:56: why?

00:17:00: I myself never since then, never used it.

00:17:03: and what i did?

00:17:04: because you are storing my data using maybe even telling to someone.

00:17:09: so that's why im also here.

00:17:13: So i use them.

00:17:14: build my own voice assistant or business system but i can't talk about personal things.

00:17:21: it manages my email calendar etc.

00:17:24: And was like I own the data.

00:17:26: If it starts manipulating me, I know what to fix.

00:17:29: Right?

00:17:30: It's my...I am in control of this voice assistant and believe that its not allowed talk about my childhood.

00:17:37: Okay thank you.

00:17:45: Give us a meaningful story now.

00:17:47: just..it is interesting because i think everyone has such moment or several moments but whats yours

00:17:56: I mean?

00:17:57: whatever they said, I already agreed.

00:18:00: But one of the things that strongly feel is we are losing human touch

00:18:05: and

00:18:05: as a person it impacted my fluency.

00:18:11: so back in time when initially my career was working as support engineer And i tend to write lot e-mails Im sure everyone has been writing lots of emails.

00:18:24: So there was a time if any customer were angry or they need some explanation to tell them that hey, it is not our fault.

00:18:31: It's your fault but its'nt even your fault and you have to understand.

00:18:35: so at the same my manager used call here we will let can write an email to explain his situations like how he can deal with this next time?

00:18:45: So I am getting better and

00:18:46: better every

00:18:47: single time now after coming into AI when i write an e-mail which I stopped doing that from last one year almost.

00:18:55: I never wrote my emails, I asked AI this is the context.

00:18:59: can you please write it?

00:19:00: Now

00:19:01: i do.

00:19:01: lot of spelling mistakes now impact a lot on my grammar and not just in writing but even when speaking to somebody right...I am suddenly speaking so fast!

00:19:17: When was doing some sessions offline talk and chat with people, right?

00:19:22: Because that's when real conversation happened.

00:19:24: And this is the reason I said we are losing human

00:19:26: touch...

00:19:27: ...and in future people will miss how in-person communication happens.. ..this what we're doing now!

00:19:34: That's why it impacted me to do a lot of spelling mistakes recently.

00:19:39: Recently i recorded one video where my wife told me you've been speaking so fast.

00:19:44: Did she realise your

00:19:45: words?!

00:19:46: And there are a lot of

00:19:47: errors as well and I have to re-report it again, realize my own deck pauses.

00:19:51: Have to do these things...and i think that what impact has a personal aswell?

00:19:57: As a comment I am sure everyone does

00:19:59: this

00:19:59: when you write your email or anything.

00:20:01: now we also do the lot spelling mistakes right.

00:20:04: so we're losing our fluency.

00:20:05: right an impact somewhere.

00:20:07: What if then tomorrow

00:20:09: because some reason

00:20:11: Right they getting banned Right, so that time you were intact your work.

00:20:17: Your personal life, professional life everything right?

00:20:22: So I just want to touch this point.

00:20:24: right...so it can be relatable for all of us and there's so many said.

00:20:29: Anais generally avoid the chatbot interactions but in a nutshell we still have part of it.

00:20:36: We still communicate because here are all of our here to advocate share what we felt and how you felt, coming together.

00:20:45: What do we want to come up with solutions?

00:20:48: And feeling the same way as what we should talk earlier right sharing a simple.

00:20:53: so I'm feeling good that they're doing this but As i said This was biggest impact in last few span.

00:21:04: Now is started.

00:21:05: small writing at least bigger context.

00:21:08: So not lose my fluency and can have the same level of human interactions which I used to have.

00:21:14: And, more on that i was enjoying my conversation whether it's writing anywhere or speaking in person.

00:21:31: Can you recommend

00:21:32: this?

00:21:32: This is not sponsored...I

00:21:33: promise!

00:21:34: This isn't a plug.. I finally got remarkable because again everyone write your scripts for YouTube with AI and I hate them.

00:21:43: I now write by hand on Remarkable, send it to the email.

00:21:47: that reads my handwriting.

00:21:48: It's my written text and i feel like it helps me think so much better than just read AI speak.

00:21:57: So yeah, so Remarkables and I also read on them Remarkably if

00:22:03: I can have a best friend.

00:22:06: Thank you!

00:22:07: What about You?

00:22:09: Sometime

00:22:10: ago

00:22:12: what is called the list of European unicorns.

00:22:15: Unicorn,

00:22:16: it's a company with over billion valuation and I was surprised that...I know maybe half of their names.

00:22:24: you know those are names we hear on daily basis and they end like AI startup from Berlin which grew rapidly lovable one of fastest growing companies in history.

00:22:38: Those names will now The other half.

00:22:41: I didn't know.

00:22:42: So, i started checking each of them.

00:22:45: Every single one is connected with defense industry.

00:22:50: It has military purpose.

00:22:52: In other words half the AI spending in Europe Is channeled into defence industry.

00:23:00: And when you break down what's actually being produced it is mostly drone production FPV drones which have only one purpose, to either destroy a single vehicle or kill a single person.

00:23:16: And they are working with surgical precision.

00:23:18: so right now in the eastern Ukraine around more than thousand people per day are losing their lives

00:23:27: and

00:23:28: all of this is fueled by those AI powered devices I think as humanity we're producing.

00:23:38: It's hard to estimate, but I guesstimate something between hundred million and two-hundred million of those drones per year.

00:23:46: And if they are not being used this year... ...they will be used the next year because they depreciate really fast you know?

00:23:54: Like technological advancement is so fast that there a good incentive for them now.

00:24:02: This terrifies me!

00:24:05: We should speak as society about these and prevent ecological footprint of data centers.

00:24:14: Yes, it is a problem but killer drones are much bigger problems.

00:24:21: What's your personal way to deal with that?

00:24:26: I

00:24:27: hope in the next seven years we will be able as unified humanity to abolish war.

00:24:36: How do you get there with AI?

00:24:39: to help a good AI, that's the question.

00:24:47: Thank you so much.

00:24:48: I hope You get a certain feeling what this evening should be about.

00:24:56: It's not about that.

00:24:57: we are finding solutions for each and every problem.

00:25:02: it's more than We would like to collect together.

00:25:08: maybe at the end, see what we can make out of it.

00:25:13: The good thing is this something I've been knowing my whole or I learned from our life...the future hours!

00:25:22: The future community will somehow be able to solve that if they are now willing go through it.

00:25:29: and This makes me to be honest.

00:25:32: every day on each terrifying thing I discover each and every day in every single corner related to AI, relate into humanity.

00:25:42: Related to economy, related to politics whatever To make it happen And so...I think herewith we open up that space i will hand over to Goda.

00:25:55: Yeah, I just want to give you one last example before we move in US right now.

00:26:02: I don't know if your following but they have a big problem with what's known flock cameras okay?

00:26:07: This is on every corner surveillance camera as you can look into the company and it's AI used monitoring.

00:26:14: that are adding Audio of.

00:26:16: those cameras are in kindergartens, in girl schools and prison showers everywhere And it's being streamed analyzed.

00:26:22: They can literally find any person and fully track you no matter what That is right now happening there.

00:26:30: Can you tell me if Berlin they would come and install surveillance cameras on every corner looking into your balconies?

00:26:38: Would Berlin and German people allow this?

00:26:42: This will be a freaking revolution.

00:26:45: So what I want to say is that there's an aspect of AI we can fully reject.

00:26:50: This is the community, this your country and some of you grew up here while i didn't but I wanted stay right?

00:26:57: I don't want surveillance cameras or kids glued with their IQ dropping.

00:27:03: so these are things where they actually have a voice.

00:27:08: okay let us move.

00:27:09: great yeah Yeah!

00:27:12: We talked.

00:27:12: This is one of the aspects.

00:27:15: that's why we're here today.

00:27:16: So now it's your turn, so you have your group there on your name?

00:27:22: Go to your group.

00:27:24: There are papers and different questions.

00:27:27: You can use them as a guide.

00:27:29: Start discussions.

00:27:31: In this paper you will see first question And for next forty five minutes.

00:27:35: We want talk about what are you afraid off happening in this community?

00:27:41: So, find your peers who will find there and I'll come give you some prompts.

00:27:46: One important thing!

00:27:48: You need to select in group two people.

00:27:51: one is going keep a time so forty five minutes.

00:27:54: another person reads out loud then we write at the end also present okay?

00:27:59: In our small groups select two people ok?

00:28:02: Thankyou

00:28:03: We will

00:28:03: be rotating incoming

00:28:05: thankyou.